AA and CTC agree (!!) that BBC program is poor

Discussion in 'Cycling Archive' started by bugbear, Dec 3, 2012.

  1. bugbear

    bugbear Guest

    bugbear, Dec 3, 2012
    #1
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  2. bugbear

    Adam Funk Guest

    Adam Funk, Dec 4, 2012
    #2
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  3. bugbear

    davethedave Guest

    I think it means "We shafted a load of footage of youtube and edited
    together."

    Some alleycat footage that is older than Jesus and some other stuff.

    In fact nothing different than what we predicted or expected.
     
    davethedave, Dec 4, 2012
    #3
  4. bugbear

    Adam Funk Guest

    I was thinking of this sort of thing:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lies_and_the_Lying_Liars_Who_Tell_Them
     
    Adam Funk, Dec 5, 2012
    #4
  5. bugbear

    davethedave Guest

    davethedave, Dec 5, 2012
    #5
  6. bugbear

    Adam Funk Guest

    That's what Fox News means by claiming to be "fair and balanced"!
     
    Adam Funk, Dec 5, 2012
    #6
  7. bugbear

    Scion Guest

    Scion, Dec 6, 2012
    #7
  8. bugbear

    Simon Mason Guest

    Everyone at work has asked me the same question to which I replied
    that I did not need to watch it - I get to star in the show for real
    every day :)
     
    Simon Mason, Dec 7, 2012
    #8
  9. bugbear

    Ace Guest

    I watched five or ten minutes of it, to see some dumb cyclist and some
    equally dumb taxi driver reliving their head-cam recorded dispute
    about how much room the taxi should have left when overtaking versus
    the fact that the cyclist banged to roof of the taxi as he passed.

    *yawn* was my first rection, followed swiftly by "don't these people
    have better things to be doing with their time than picking arguments
    with other road users?".

    Switched over after that point.
     
    Ace, Dec 7, 2012
    #9
  10. bugbear

    Colin Reed Guest

    Yes. It was predictable mainly - with a few interesting bits. The story
    of the woman whose daughter was killed by a left turning cement lorry was
    very moving and actually mainly well handled. The footage of the Lucas
    Bunelle film wasn't quite as pervasive as originally implied. However,
    in other forums, some of the contributors have mentioned that they got
    phone calls about an hour before the show was broadcast saying that some
    of their clips wouldn't be used - there is suspicion that there was some
    last minute editing, possibly in response to criticism from preview
    viewings by MPs. The main point wasn't that it was unbalanced -
    unfortunately it instead portrayed cyclists and motorists as so polarised
    it became slightly ridiculous. It finished with a reasonably
    conciliatory tone, saying that people should be calmer and try to get on,
    but that wasn't helped by suggesting for the rest of the time that there
    is full war raging all around. I guess a documentary showing that the
    vast majority of cycle and road journeys are generally peaceful and
    mundane wouldn't have excited the commissioning editors enough to get
    shown on prime time BBC1.

    Colin
     
    Colin Reed, Dec 7, 2012
    #10
  11. bugbear

    nmm1 Guest

    Not really. The main cause is mindset, yes, but it includes much
    more than laziness: prejudice, ignorance, irrationality etc. And
    genuine issues of practicality aren't as far behind as you imply;
    most posters here don't seem to accept that the majority of the
    population is not as physically capable as they are.


    Well, yes, but that is also irrelevant. As I tried beating into the bone
    heads of some self-proclaimed pro-cycling campaigners, that doesn't help.
    If only 0.1% are actively hostile, and you interact with a 100 drivers a
    day (pretty typical), that's one a fortnight - and those were roughly the
    figures I was seeing.

    For reasonably able cyclists, only (say) 1% of those incidents will end up
    in a crash but, for the less able, it could be above 10%. That's 2-3
    crashes a year caused by aggression. And crashes on the road are dangerous,
    especially for the elderly.

    And that's the problem.


    Regards,
    Nick Maclaren.
     
    nmm1, Dec 7, 2012
    #11
  12. bugbear

    Simon Mason Guest

    I always find it most odd when a motorist is in so much of a hurry
    like the taxi driver was that he had to pass by dangerously close
    instead of waiting for a safe place and yet he then seems to have all
    the time in the world to argue the toss with the cyclist. I can never
    work that one out - are they in a hurry or not?
     
    Simon Mason, Dec 7, 2012
    #12
  13. In uk.rec.cycling.moderated on Fri, 07 Dec 2012 11:46:20 +0000
    I had to really want to cycle to work.

    I've done it in cycles so to speak, commuting by bicycle for a while
    then not because I moved house or work and it wasn't practical.

    Each time I had to really want to do it because it was faffing about,
    it was hard work, the weather meant I was sweaty or cold, and so on.
    There were many easier ways.

    I remember moving house so the commute was doubled. It was still
    ridiculously short by the standards of many here, but it was twice
    what I was used to and mostly uphill. And being done in the
    Australian summer.

    The first couple of weeks I collapsed in a park on the way home,
    hunting shade to lie in and try and get the energy up to complete the
    trip. Gradually I got fitter and didn't have to do that anymore. And
    as I got fitter I rode the bike more because it was fun and not work.

    That's the real trick... to realise it can be enjoyable. It's not an
    easy thing to believe especially if you are unfit and have easier ways
    to get to where you are going. You have to believe the game is worth
    the candle, and that takes a shedload of faith.

    There's a reason most gym memberships aren't used. The payoff is a
    long way away and you have to have faith there will be one. For many
    they can't keep that faith alive long enough.

    Zebee
     
    Zebee Johnstone, Dec 7, 2012
    #13
  14. bugbear

    Simon Mason Guest

    I couldn't agree more - two of my workmates took up cycle commuting
    during early autumn and vowed to continue through the winter - both
    packed it in as soon as it started getting chilly and dark. I also
    notice that the Sheffield stands I use which were chocka block in the
    summer now have only two bikes there, one of which is mine. Can't
    blame them really - two days ago I was caught out in a blizzard which
    coated my glasses so they had to be removed to the top of my head.
    After that, I could hardly see due to each eyeball being pinged by
    snowflakes hitting them at 50mph. What was doubly annoying was that
    all I heard on the radio was that there were "difficult driving
    conditions" out there.
     
    Simon Mason, Dec 7, 2012
    #14
  15. bugbear

    Toom Tabard Guest

    Available to view on:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01p7q2l/War_on_Britains_Roads/

    It was a useful if predictable illustration that poor, too fast, and aggressive cycling and driving will result in accidents, arguments and violence, as well as showing the obvious solution to most of it. The contributions of the police cyclist, the cyclists genuinely put at risk by dangerous driving, the bereaved mother of a cyclist, and the reasonable drivers featured who voiced their concerns about the problems caused to them by dangerous and incompetent cyclists and their concerns for the cyclists themselves, were were well summed up by the bereaved mother - "it's a competitive space - it needs to be a co-operative space". That has been the solution all along. It needs all road users to act defensively and with consideration for other road users and to allow themselves time and space to deal with their own errors and misjudgments as well as the actions of others.
    As far as cycling is concerned many scenes did illustrate how much more many cyclists could do to protect themselves and in doing so could also present a better image which might alter the attitudes and aggression towards them and make them even safer.

    Toom
     
    Toom Tabard, Dec 7, 2012
    #15
  16. bugbear

    Sara Guest

    I didn't see it, but from what I've heard that sounds like the kind of
    reaction I would have had, too.
     
    Sara, Dec 7, 2012
    #16
  17. bugbear

    Sara Guest

    I don't enjoy my cycle commute. I do it because it's the most efficient
    way for me to get to work. That doesn't mean I can't appreciate the sky
    as it was just after sunrise today, or the deer in the park during the
    rut. But the actual cycling - I've never enjoyed it and I doubt I ever
    will.
     
    Sara, Dec 7, 2012
    #17
  18. bugbear

    nmm1 Guest

    It isn't that they are in a particular hurry in that case, it's the
    case in general. What you have missed is that the increase in
    traffic and, much more, the road 'improvements' have meant that there
    often is no safe place to pass for an unreasonable distance. Indeed,
    one of the standard objectives of modern road 'improvements' is
    specifically to prevent overtaking, because a lot of accidents are
    caused by one motor vehicle overtaking another!

    I have timed this. On typical urban and suburban trips, ones that
    would take 10 minutes at the dead of night (while still driving
    cautiously and legally), congestion often added 5 minutes but being
    stuck behind slow cyclists often added 10 minutes. That can happen
    on rural trips, too, but is rarer (for road design reasons). Note
    that 'slow' is relative to the driving speed.

    For anyone for whom time is money, the irritation with cyclists
    builds up, and the incident is merely the trigger. The fact that
    the root cause isn't cyclists but Planners is irrelevant, for well
    known psychological reasons.


    Regards,
    Nick Maclaren.
     
    nmm1, Dec 7, 2012
    #18
  19. There are days I enjoy it, but mostly it's just Going To Work - one of
    those things that needs doing. I only actively dislike it when the
    weather's really fscking awful.

    Matthew
     
    Matthew Vernon, Dec 7, 2012
    #19
  20. bugbear

    Simon Mason Guest

    That argument oddly enough does not seem to apply to riders on
    horseback, of which I see plenty out on country lanes, even during the
    week. I have yet to see a driver sounding his horn, revving his engine
    or attempting a very close pass at a horse rider or a group of them. I
    have also never seen or heard a driver get out of his car and shout at
    such a rider for "holding them up" or for not paying "road tax". This
    also applies to the many rag and bone men patrolling the streets of
    Hull with their horse and carts. For some reason they are afforded the
    sort of time and patience many cyclist dream of.
     
    Simon Mason, Dec 7, 2012
    #20
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